Saab DI Cotrol with MSII ???

[_Adrian_]

hey guys...
i'm just about to get a newer car
1996 Saab 900 2.0T 5Spd

just wondering has anyone tried to get MS to work with the DI cassete ??
im a bit fuzzy on this system and even after reading a couple of posts, the whole concept is still a bit hazy.

so far i understood that the DI cassete uses a voltage to across the plugg for ionization till TDC is reached when by the preset advance and timing parameters the DI controler sends the signal to ignite the mixture.
(if i didnt missunderstood the whole thing, then i have to re-read the whole thing again :@ )

but what i was wondering is that will the router board or the GPIO board have any provisions for direct control of the DI cassete ??

any info or ideas would be welcomed.
want to start modding as soon as i can
got a couple of things already built up in the back of my mind already ;)

[_Adrian_]

nobody ???
Bruce, Al, Lance anyone ???

I dont want to go to wasted spark when i already have a very efficient ignition system.

[tjksn]

Adrian,

I have been watching the happenings here for awhile and although I haven't used MS at this point I am certain that without code and hardware changes you won't be able to control the DI the way Saab does. I'm not an expert on either system, but as a Saab owner and one who has learned a little bit about the DI I'll share with you what I know. As you mentioned Saab puts a DC voltage on the plug for ion sensing. They use that to determine knock and pre-ignition and use that information to adapt the timing to changing conditions on a cylinder by cylinder basis.

That being said, since you don't want to go to wasted spark, you don't have much choice in what you can do. The DI cassette in your car is controlled by the Trionic system which handles EVERYTHING on the engine. So, if you go to MS you'll still have to let the Trionic have access to the inputs it needs. There is one thing though. The Trionic will not be able to enrich the mixture if the DI detects pre-ignition, which is how it deals with this. As I said, I'm not an expert so I hope I haven't confused you any.

I will add this, if you want a system that you can program yourself then MS is the way to go IMO. The Saabs have lots of power that can be gotten out of them, but it is expensive to get the Trionic reprogrammed. With the MS you can tailor it to your liking adjusting the timing curve and fuel enrichment to get the results you want. It will mean wasted spark, but I don't think that is such a bad thing at this point. I think that Ultra MS is possibly going to accomodate this in it's hardware and software.

Tom R.
'93 Saab 900 turbo

[Matt Cramer]

You may wish to search the High Tech Topics forum for "Ion sensing ignition." There's been some talk of using the SAAB DI module but I don't think anyone has a running example.

[2screwed]

so far i understood that the DI cassete uses a voltage to across the plugg for ionization till TDC is reached when by the preset advance and timing parameters the DI controler sends the signal to ignite the mixture.
(if i didnt missunderstood the whole thing, then i have to re-read the whole thing again :@ )

Adrian,

The DI cassette is not that complicated at all, even though it works with ion-sensing the control signals is not complicated. You have 4 trigger inputs, 2 misfire outputs and 1 knock signal output. As Matt said the function is described here:http://www.msefi.com/viewtopic.php?p=47 ... ght=#47814

Lars

[_Adrian_]

Tom R. '93 Saab 900 turbo

hey tom...
the reason why i ask is that i completely want to ditch the trionic before i do any performance upgrades to the car.
i have been folowing MS from its early early stages and now whithin the next couple of weeks i will slowly start building the V3 seeing a post earlier on today on TSL (the saablink, see link below) where someone claims that they have MS running using the DI cassete !

http://www.saablink.net/forum/showthrea ... 421&page=4

[Keithg]

Adrian,

I responded over at Saablink as well.

I have no illusions about using DI to sense knock or preignition nor to use it as a second input to do sequential spark. I merely use it as a replacement for the distributor. It can be driven, though I feel MS-II is more suited to doing all of it. I am running MSnS-E (ms-I) and am driving the Di cassette as sequential ignition only. I made a can sensor that goes in the dizzy hole and gives me a 1 per rev signal so that I can run COP.

If I understand MS-II, there is no second input for COP as of yet, so you would be limited to wasted spark and the Di cassette is probably not a good candidate to use for that as there is only 1 capacitor for all 4 cylinders that needs 2.5ms to charge between firings.

KeithG

[_Adrian_]

thanks for the reply Keith...
i am aware that ion sensing wont happen for a long while.
all i want is to be able to tune the car with every change that i make so that i wont have to sell off limbs and organs to keep up with the chipping/programing of the factory unit!!

Probably gonna run MS2V3.
now are al the sensors compatible with the gm units or do i have to repalce ( even though in colaboration with gm they might/not use their parts)

[Keithg]

Well, MS2V3 cannot yet do it. MSnS-E 029Q sure can, though.

KeithG

On 5/7/06, _Adrian_ <adrculda@yahoo.ca (adrculda@yahoo.ca) > wrote:

thanks for the reply Keith...
i am aware that ion sensing wont happen for a long while.
all i want is to be able to tune the car with every change that i make so that i wont have to sell off limbs and organs to keep up with the chipping/programing of the factory unit!!

Probably gonna run MS2V3.
now are al the sensors compatible with the gm units or do i have to repalce ( even though in colaboration with gm they might/not use their parts)



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