Microsquirt v3 timing/fuel issues.

[ilostmymindcom]

Well, here is my NEW problem, or results.
With Inj 1 going to 1+4, and spark 1 going to 1+4, if you disconnect cylinder 2 or 3 plug wire or injector, it doesn't stumble, it runs the same.
If inj 1 is going to 2+3 and spark 2 going to 2+3, if you disconnect cylinder 1 or 4 plug wire or injector, it doesn't stumble.
My egt is on #4, thus the cooler egts.
I hope that makes sense.

[ilostmymindcom]

Not to try and sound like I know what I am doing, but this is what I get on the scope:
Inj 1 w/cam signal:

inj 2 w/cam signal:

ignout1 w/cam signal:

Ignout2 w/ cam signal:


I have an idea what I am seeing here. but that is all. I just watched a youtube video on how to use my digi-o-scope (first time)
I see 5 inj pulses on inj1 and 2, and they are happening at the same cam phase from what I can see. It looks like ignition is correct. Maybe I am having an injection timing problem then.

//edit: this is during cranking. ~200 rpm. the injectors were disconnected, that's why they are just blips.
I am using this digi-o-scope http://www.focussz.com/eshowProDetail.asp?ProID=1482

[ilostmymindcom]

Just to entertain myself (in hopes of success), I wired the injectors up as bank 1 (1+2) bank 2 (3+4)... no good.
I tore the top of the motor open and verified mechanical timing, the cams are in sync with the crank, I have tdcc1 (top dead center compression #1) correct.
The cas can adjust ~50* of crank timing, verified with light. ~20-~70* trigger offset to compensate.
I am going to install another set of injectors I have, they are 1050cc low imp.

I flashed to ms2/extra to see if it was any better or worse. It was the same. I re-made my tune with the ms2/extra base map.
I even installed the factory trigger disk (4/2) and put it in 4g63 spark mode, I think it ran a bit better, but still skyhigh egt.
I then wired up my ms3 from my other car, in 4g63 mode and 24-1 mode, same results.
I wonder what could be wrong.
Compression test is 195 on all 4, verified a few times.

Here is a picture of my setup as of now:

[ilostmymindcom]

running o-scopes:
http://ilostmymind.com/upload/ignout1running.gif
http://ilostmymind.com/upload/inj1running.gif

[grippo]

I ran your next to last tune, the one just before the ign 1,2 inj1,2 plots. I see two things: I get ign 2 sparks that are mid-way between the ign 1 sparks, as they should be, your plots seem to show the sparks of ign2 are not centered between those of ign1. Not sure why, but if your timing light shows the same advance for both spark banks, then they are ok.
Second, my I got no injections from channel 2 - but I changed the no squirts in the msq to 4 and the second injector fired just fine. 4 was what you had in your 1st tune and that is correct.

[ilostmymindcom]

Alright, Here's what we have today.
I changed it to 4/alternating squirts and now I hear/feel a difference when 1/2/3/4 plug wires are disconnected, but still ~1300*F (700c) EGT at ~800rpm idle.
So, I figured maybe I should get creative/simplified. I took another cam wheel and effectively made it dual 12-1 crank wheels.
I filled two holes opposite of each other. so 11 teeth, then a missing one, then 11 more, and a missing one.
This has the same results. I set the tune to crank wheel, and adjusted my offset (since both are 7.5 teeth btdcc1) still ~1300*F (700c) EGT.
I have also noticed that my timing advanced with rpm still... I'll address that once I have cooler egts, unless anyone thinks that may be effecting it?
THEN, I tried advancing/retarding my cam gear (exhaust).
The results were as expected. Retarding the cam (increase overlap) increased EGT by about 200*F (100c), advancing (decrease overlap) did the opposite.
I don't recall which way required more fuel, but it didn't change the egt much.
AND YES, THE EGT IS ACCURATE. I see red glows on the pipes if I let it idle for a few minutes. I also confirmed with a propane torch.
I get the same results with 2 different probes.

It seems to run well now, other than the high egt temps.

this will be a slow moving off road vehicle, so it cannot have high egts at idle.

Any other ideas?

[ilostmymindcom]

Wondering if maybe my turbine housing was causing excessive back pressure, I opened up the header.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-hSda3waBI
same results. EGT is higher because of the revs, but not by much.

[24c]

...
I changed it to 4/alternating squirts and now I hear/feel a difference when 1/2/3/4 plug wires are disconnected, but still ~1300*F (700c) EGT at ~800rpm idle....
This has the same results. I set the tune to crank wheel, and adjusted my offset (since both are 7.5 teeth btdcc1) still ~1300*F (700c) EGT....
AND YES, THE EGT IS ACCURATE. I see red glows on the pipes if I let it idle for a few minutes. I also confirmed with a propane torch....

Any other ideas?

Have you used a lambda sensor on the mixture, tried more fuel, altered the ignition timing. I don't know if you can alter the injection times with B&G code, as I have never done it, but normally high EGTs (burning in the exhaust) are associated with late combustion, & too lean a mixture. I wouldn't expect to see the pipes glow at idle either, so something is not right.

[ilostmymindcom]

...
I changed it to 4/alternating squirts and now I hear/feel a difference when 1/2/3/4 plug wires are disconnected, but still ~1300*F (700c) EGT at ~800rpm idle....
This has the same results. I set the tune to crank wheel, and adjusted my offset (since both are 7.5 teeth btdcc1) still ~1300*F (700c) EGT....
AND YES, THE EGT IS ACCURATE. I see red glows on the pipes if I let it idle for a few minutes. I also confirmed with a propane torch....

Any other ideas?

Have you used a lambda sensor on the mixture, tried more fuel, altered the ignition timing. I don't know if you can alter the injection times with B&G code, as I have never done it, but normally high EGTs (burning in the exhaust) are associated with late combustion, & too lean a mixture. I wouldn't expect to see the pipes glow at idle either, so something is not right.

Yes, I have an innovative lc1. in one of my videos I show the change between lean run and rich run.
Last night I had a friend of mine come over and make sure I wasn't totally insane. We threw some ideas at it. We popped in new injectors, same thing.....
So I have eliminated almost every piece of hardware. Today I will try to read up on what teh extra code can do injection timing wise, and go from there.

[grippo]

There is an injection timing angle variable in the code you are using under Fuel Setup, General. You have it set to 0 in one msq and 582 deg (near default value) in another. You have to be in sequential for this to work, so restore the 24 -1 wheel. Even then, you are not really in sequential, since you only have 2 inj outputs, but you can still move timing around so you get it out of a bad spot. Generally, you never want to squirt anywhere near the intake valve overlap. If you get away from this region you generally don't see much change from the timing, but all engines are different. So if one of the cylinders is in a bad spot, you can get it out while still also keeping its paired cylinder away from its bad spot. I would move the timing in 100 deg increments and see if there is noticeable change, say 580, 680, 480, 380, 280, 180.