Trigger wheel selection for GSXR1100

[TiziK]

Hey everyone,

This is such a great forum. I am completely overwhelmed with the amount of info and knowledge here. I have been searching and reading for the last few hours (no joke) and have searched myself into a circle. I feel more confused now than before I started. I'm on info overload and just can't think any more.

I am trying to figure out my trigger wheel and VR sensor option.

My set-up is:

Microsquirt V3
Quad-spark
2 wire COP (2011 gsxr1000)
GSXR 600 throttle bodies
No cam sensor, wasted spark only.
This will be used on a turbo application too.

I have attached a photo of the OEM trigger wheel and sensors. There is a measuring tape in the photo for size reference.

2014-01-12 19.29.09.jpg

(231.29 KiB) Not downloaded yet

My question is, will the OEM set-up be compatible with the MSv3?

If not, what are my options?

I read time and time again about a 36-1 trigger wheel, but I can't find one in the diameter I need.

Someone please shed some light here?

Thanks!

[24c]

Hi TiziK,

I think what you have will work, it won't be the best resolution, but you'd use "Dual Tach Inputs" mode with your v3, and it'll run. You might have to separate the black wires from each VR sensor if they are shared to get the v3 to see the VR pulses OK. I am assuming that is a crank based trigger, if it's cam based then using "Dual inputs timing from 1 cam tooth" which is 1b in the link below.

I have a similar set up, on a flat twin and I have experimented with different triggers. Your best bet is a missing tooth wheel, but whatever you do with the original wheel will be comparable with the OEM set up. Later on you could change it, and lose a VR sensor.

Good luck
Mike

PS your using 1a in this link, http://www.useasydocs.com/details/dualspark.htm
PPS there is a possibility the trigger wheel might work better if it was narrower, but you can look at this later, if you have hassle.

[TiziK]

Thank you for the reply 24c.

That will get me started I think. I wasn't sure if I should have been trying to source another type of trigger wheel. Reading it all today with a fresh head really helps.

Using that 1a set-up, I think you are correct in saying that it should perform the same as OEM. With that said, going with that set-up, how do you think the MS will handle high RPM? Max will be ~ 11000 rpm.

[TiziK]

One more thing, if I wanted to get a 36-1 wheel, where can I find one that will fit in the available space I have?

I have searched several times now but the smallest I can find is 2.5".

Any links?

[24c]

Using that 1a set-up, I think you are correct in saying that it should perform the same as OEM. With that said, going with that set-up, how do you think the MS will handle high RPM? Max will be ~ 11000 rpm.

Using the "Dual Tach Input, Timing from 1 Cam tooth" mode, I can get rpms detected from 30-18000 rpm on my test rig, however with a 12-1 wheel using the missing tooth mode, and using light oil in the bearing (higher speeds), I get rpms detected from 50-19667 rpm. I don't think you will have a problem, neither do I think you need 36-1.
Your tooth width is affected by the width of the VR sensor tip, so ideally you don't want it smaller than that, and working backwards I don't think you have enough space on that diameter to achieve this. 12-1 or 24-1 would be good enough, and better than OEM.

EDIT- I have just done a quick search since my original post for "gsxr 1100 trigger wheel", and they are available in 36-1 flavours, but read the threads that come up...one guy was turboing his using a MicroSquirt v3 too.

I am using Hall sensors, but the VRs with a Microsquirt v3 will work OK. They use VR sensors in jet engines, so I don't think you
have to worry about rpm limits with the sensor.

Mike

PS My Yamaha GTS1000 crankshaft had 4 teeth, the YZF1000 a not quite 8-1 set up and that was good for 11,000 with the older cased MicroSquirt v2.

[slingy88]

Hi,

This is what i used on my GSXR turbo.
triggerwheels.com 51mm universal 36-1 wheel. Turned the origional crank trigger down so was tight on the part that sits in the crank end, then turned out the centre of the 36-1 wheel untill it was a tight press fit, then pushed together in the vice. Before doing this i made ajig from scrap to keep the TDC reference so it could transfered to the new wheel.
Then the whole thing needed turning down untill it just cleared the VR sensor.Then just wired the stock Vr sensor straight into the VR input of the MuS. And you want to set TDC on tooth 9 after the missing one, this then allows good timing prediction as after the missing tooth reference, you have 90 deg BTDC to play with.

Cheers Jack

[TiziK]

So you only used one vr sensor I see. Were there any issues with the signal breaking up throughout the rev range?

And ultimately, what are the odds you can make another one up?

[dontz125]

The 36-1 should be fine well past the 11k red line, especially with the new MAX9926 VR chip.

TiziK - please confirm the year of your bike. I find it VERY hard to fathom that a 2011 sport bike is a) still using a dual-spark ignition, and b) is NOT already EFI! (head scratch)

[slingy88]

So you only used one vr sensor I see. Were there any issues with the signal breaking up throughout the rev range?

And ultimately, what are the odds you can make another one up?

Yep just one VR is fine with this style trigger wheel and wasted spark. Keep it simple i say lol
This set up was origionally built on my old 750 short stroke motor and that reved to 12500RPM.
Spark has ALWAYS been great, other than plugs getting fouled up durring tuning, but its rock steady advance at idle and has been very good through out.
Mate i can make one up, but i am in Oz. would be looking at about $150 AU and your origional crank trigger in exchange. ( i have a spare here to make one from but would need it replaced, hence the exchange and i'll throw in my msq for you to copy if you like). If your building a turbo bike mate, really need to find someone local to you with a lathe to help with nocking up stuff like this.
Any other help just ask, glad to help another GSXR get squirted
You can check mine out here http://www.msgroups.com/viewtopic.php?f ... 88#p149188

Cheers jack

[slingy88]

The 36-1 should be fine well past the 11k red line, especially with the new MAX9926 VR chip.

TiziK - please confirm the year of your bike. I find it VERY hard to fathom that a 2011 sport bike is a) still using a dual-spark ignition, and b) is NOT already EFI! (head scratch)

The 2011 was just for his COP's.
Judging by his comment about me only using one Vr sensor his bike will likely be a 1985 to 1987 ish GSXR1100 with the 1052cc motor and origionally would have had Mikuni 34mm CV carbs i think as these still used 2 Vr sensors. After that they went to 1.